Our Scotland - www.our-scotland.org

Neil

A letter from me in the Scotsman today.
http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/letters.cfm?id=1614032006
Only the first sentence & a half appears (rest shown <>) still it means that 2 of the 4 letters chosen are sceptical about the warming scare. I like the way the "widely unreported" remark about the Oregon Petition, & by implication the entire sceptical view, was removed. But to be fair to the Scotsman they did print part of this & the Herald, which is my local rag, didn't. This letter also went out to a considerable number of other papers some of which I will miss, so if anybody sees it please let me know where. The Herald printed 5 letters, not one of which was sceptical.

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Cado · I Love 'Our Scotland' Joined: 14 May 2006 Posts: 283

To be honest - whether its happening or not is irrelevent IMO.

The whole of the Western world runs on oil - its must be THE primary source of energy - manufacturing feedstock. Oil runs everything.

We've been lucky thus far in that the West (say 600M people - very ish) as been the sole 'demand' of this feedstock.

However with China (1Bn) and India (1Bn) and many others rapidly developing - we're all going to be competing for a dwindling resource. We've possibly got the most to loose (IMO) - since at least the others are still generally 'peasent' based economies. ie they can still live a basic lifestyle if needed, they've still got their 'basic' skills.

We're now pretty reliant of automation - we're 100% dependent on needing oil. Oil thats lies under the ground in other parts of the world - who can then name their price. Whether or not global warming is real - to me its our reliance on oil that needs to be tackled.

We need to develop technology that takes us beyond oil. As much as I often ridicule the bearded sandel wearing tree-huggers - for once I think 'swampy' has it 100% right. Being 100% reliant on others nations to keep your economy going is just daft - a hostage to fortune waiting to happen.

The EU (at least) - needs to be self sustaining, at least in all the fundementals. Thereafter I think its wise that all regions of the EU (whether 'states', 'nations' etc) be self-sufficient as far as reasonably practible.

Just think its common sence.

Neil · Posted: Thu Nov 02, 2006 10:27 am Post subject:

I'm less worried than you Cado about the oil running out, peak oil has been prophesied for generations, but I take your point that if the "3rd world" starts achieving prosperity the demand will go up, this is already visibly happening, & supply cannot increase equally.

One of the reasons I am so pro-nuclear - there are enough radioactives in the Earth's crust to give the entire world our power levels forever.
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The aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.
H. L. Mencken

SLG · Posted: Sat Nov 04, 2006 10:52 am Post subject:

Neil · Posted: Sat Nov 04, 2006 12:36 pm Post subject:

I would like to see solar power satellites in the sky some time. I could also see cold fusion & ocean theraml working well. You are quite right that human ingenuity can design other things, if human obstructiveness doesn't stop it.

Nonetheless all these are generations away & we are where cwe are now. We know we can solve all our energy problems now with nuclear & make the whole world rich into the bargain. I find maintaining poverty & deaths, when it is unnecessary, an obscenity.
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The aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.
H. L. Mencken

SLG · Posted: Sat Nov 04, 2006 1:08 pm Post subject:

Aye, sorry Neil, I'm too used to talking about nuclear just wrt Scotland. I totally agree that nuclear can and should be used to solve many of these problems, making hopefully less problematic new problems along the way. There needs to be a balance and for risk to be minimised. That's why I agree with the use of nuclear in certain circumstances, but I would still argue that it isn't necessary for Scotland.

Neil · Posted: Sat Nov 04, 2006 1:27 pm Post subject:

Then we are probably as close as 2 people can get with a basic disagreement.
I assume you think renewables could replace the 50% of our power that comes from Hunterston, Torness & the coal plants which will have to close in 2015 when new emission standards come in.

I don't, but that is a technical question which we have been through before.
_________________
The aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.
H. L. Mencken

Morph · Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2006 7:20 pm Post subject:

I feel that nuclear energy could be good in the short term unitl some of the more eco friendly ideas are more developed. Then these could be rolled in. Hte problem with nuclear could be the same as teh current problem that although there are risks and such like people and governments dont want to move technologies once one is proving to work fine.
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"An oppressive government is to be more feared than a tiger"

Neil · Posted: Wed Nov 08, 2006 11:21 am Post subject:

This was the position of Nicol Stephen on the BBC "energy debate" that "nuclear is the easy answer" & thus must be opposed because once it is running the voters won't be wiliing to pay out subsidies for windmills etc.

This argument implicitly accepts that public fears of nuclear are based on scare stories rather than actuality & would be disproved by the actuality. I also accept this as fact but dispute the morality of such an argument.

If somebody came up with a system which on a balance of cost, ability to provide large amounts of electricity, long term sustainability & pollution improved on nuclear I would support it. Fusion is a very long way from working, ocean thermal looks theoretically good but the engineering is a long way from being done. My favourite for this is solar power satellites, which merely depends on us having a sizeable spacegoing civilisation. We will have that one day but it is not currently an answer.
_________________
The aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.
H. L. Mencken

SLG · Posted: Wed Nov 08, 2006 1:39 pm Post subject:

azzuri · 'Our Scotland' Fossil Joined: 12 Sep 2005 Posts: 3771

While China, India et al are all industrializing at an alarming rate and thus are using more and more fossil fuels, our efforts to scale back our oil and fossil fuel usage are like pissing into the wind....

If they can find a cost-effective way to get rid of the waste, I'm all for Nuclear...
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"Every single person on this planet is unique. Just like everyone else..." - Random Guy in Edinburgh Pub

Possibly the funniest site in the world, 'The Daily Mash' - http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/

Neil · Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2006 10:42 am Post subject:

Bury it several thousand feet down in sealed containers & leave it - because reactor waste was a short half life within decades it will be perfectly safe even should somebody accidentally run across it.
_________________
The aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.
H. L. Mencken

thelandisoors · Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 2:28 pm Post subject:

I wonder when jupiter, saturn & pluto are going to be taxing their citizens for driving land rovers to combat global warming on their planets too. I think the case is pretty open and shut... it is proven the sun is getting hotter and all the planets are warming up. have a peek in new scientist. Rolling Eyes

yea... I've got a bone to pick about the "land rover" tax... yes, I drive a great big defender... but as of March when we move fulltime to our croft I will be 100% off grid. wind & solar powered, will be growing part of my own heating in biomass crops organically plus cutting my own peat, growing a good portion of my families own food and medicine, harvesting rainwater, composting my humanure, living in a low impact dwelling and will continue to be zero waste (yes I'm one of the weirdos that unpackages & leaves plastic tomato trays at the store and bring my own reusable bags) My defender is a power plant... a tractor... and transports never less than 3 people from A to B and they bloomin' tax me? This annoys me... and frankly I think rightly so. We ought to be taxing convenience appliances. Electric tin openers should cost £5000; wasteful in their manufacture, use, and refuse and completely useless, sidestepping, wasteful, disgraceful gadgetry in a long line of others as equally stupid. I'd race any electric tin opener with a crude army survival knife tin opener any day of the week! Cool

Am I a Luddite? No... I think we need to embrace the "right" technology.. that's all.

I think there are far better options in Scotland for power than nuclear... whether it's fission or fusion... the uranium trade and nuclear technology are still very dangerous considering the nutters running this planet. Think about all the depleted uranium, the byproduct of the nuclear industry, our militaries are destroying beautiful countries all over the place with! Besides... it should not be about MORE power it should be about LESS power... how much power does one bloody need? Careful thought in housing development could remedy this situation in a few strokes of the sensical pen. We're barely outta the jungle folks..

Am I poopooing global warming? No.. I'm well aware we are a bunch of overconsuming, wasteful pigs.. really. I say, what the hell is wrong with running out of oil? We have the chemical/petroleum/pharmaceutical complex that kills more than it cures. The plastic industry... yuck, yuck, yuck! Anything that we kill other people for I think we could do without.. but, I also think peak oil is a scam! They didn't go to Iraq to get oil.. they went to turn the spigot off! They didn't like Saddam jerkin' the oil markets up and down. Think about it... Iraq has/is allowed less oil wells in operation than Texas. The opec cartel has a quota for a reason... to keep the prices jacked up. If its not common knowledge it should be.... Scotland has more oil than we know what to do with, regardless of what kinda crap they tell you on the telly. Apparently, there is more oil underneath the minch then all the oil we are pumping from the currently tapped pools in the North Sea. When the stakes are high in a poker game you don't start telling people what you have in your hand do you? Very Happy

Neil · Posted: Mon Nov 27, 2006 12:32 pm Post subject:

I would agree that we are not about to run out of oil if only because shale oil is recoverable in quantities that make conventional oil look small. Currently that is relatively expensive, though cheap if oil prices were to stay anywhere near current levels & as technology improves the price is coming down.

http://www.imra.org.il/story.php3?id=31531

If there are large resources of Scottish oil we punters may be being kept in the dark but I cannot see the other "poker players" not having heard.
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The aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.
H. L. Mencken