Our Scotland - www.our-scotland.org

Red Justice

Saturday 10 Jan - STOP THE WAR ON GAZA

Stop Israel's crime against humanity

Scotland-wide Demonstration in Edinburgh

Assemble 12:30pm East Market Street (behind Edinburgh Waverley Train Station)

March through the city centre and to the US Consulate.

Bring in-date medicine for Gaza, and spare shoes.

Supported by Stop the War Scotland, Glasgow and Edinburgh, Pauline McNeil MSP, Sandra White MSP, Muslim Association of Britain, Scottish Palestine Solidarity Campaign, Glasgow Palestine Human Rights Campaign, Lebanese Community Scotland, Scottish Afghan Society, Scottish Islamic Foundation, Scottish Friends of Palestine, Scottish CND , SACC and others

COACHES TO THE DEMONSTRATION

Towns and cities across Scotland are organising coaches to
bring protestors to Edinburgh.

Inverness Demo
1pm Sat 10 Jan, outside the Royal bank of Scotland on the pedestrian precinct in Inverness.

London Demo
Assemble 12.30pm Sat 10 Jan, Hyde Park, London
March to Israeli Embassy, London W8

National Demo organised by Palestine Solidarity Campaign, Stop the War Coalition, British Muslim Initiative, Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament and many other organisations.

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Scotland86 · Gaining a Reputation Joined: 12 Dec 2008 Posts: 249

Ok im now thinking we need a "Stop the violence against Israel" march.

Rinty · Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:54 am Post subject:

That would be the most ludicrous march ever. It would be a bit like having a march for the vichy as they were facing bombs from the free resistance.

The urgent thing, in my opinion, is opening the egyptian borders to let the people out.

Israel have the people hemmed in and, until yesterday, the only safe havens were UN sponsored schols and uni's. But Israel have now made those safe places a target too.

There is nowhere to go for the people, nowhere to run, they cant leave by boat or by air as Israel dont allow them a port or airport, their only means of escape would be into Egypt.

Egypt MUST open the border now.

Scotland86 · Gaining a Reputation Joined: 12 Dec 2008 Posts: 249

But when ever anywhere is made safe Hamas take it over to protect there fighters and munitions.

Rinty · Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 12:19 pm Post subject:

thats just not true

mairead · Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 12:59 pm Post subject:

Well Hamas should not have been sending rockets into Israel which caused the recent Israeli retaliation. It was also Hamas, a terrorist organisation by the way, which brought the recent short cease fire to an end by firing in two more rockets.
Also, civilian casualties in Palestine would not have been neaerly so bad if Hamas did not use civilian areas and civilians as shields from which to attack.
The implications, should Israel not defend itself are too awful to think about, for example, and IMHO, Iran is just watching and waiting.........
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Rinty · Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 1:05 pm Post subject:

mairead, all of gaza is a civilian area.

The people who live in gaza live as refugees, Israel dont allow them to return to live in their own land.

This fight was there long before hamas.

Anyomje who starts this debate from rockets in recent weeks, I am sorry, but your pinions are ludicrous.

There was a 6 month ceasefire that hamas stuck to. Howvere, Israel s[pent that six months intimidationg and muliating the gazan people on a daily basis. They carried out a sifge, blocking medicals supplies and water.

When the six months expired there was no way hamas could agree to extend the ceasefire as the humanitarian crisis got worse.

the lack of medical suuplies and water didnt start just last week mairead.

Holebender · Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 1:08 pm Post subject:

Do you know what Gaza's like? Where would you suggest Hamas or anyone else go to find a sparsely populated non-civilian area from which to conduct their operations?

If some Jews had fought back against the Germans keeping them in their concentration camp, and the Nazis had reacted by liquidating the camp, would you be blaming the inmates for starting it?
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Scotland86 · Gaining a Reputation Joined: 12 Dec 2008 Posts: 249

Jesus talking about blowing it all out of proportion. How come you only talk about what the people of Gaza have said and what Hamas and Fatah have said? how about we talk about what the Israelis have been saying. Hamas are tunneling into Egypt to smuggle weapons I take it this is a lie. They as Mairead said are purposely firing from civilian areas. Ok so you say all of Gaza is a civilian area but i think using a school as a launch site is sick and using the Uni as a weapons lab well thats 2 examples of how they are purposely and knowingly using humans as shields.

Holebender · Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 1:22 pm Post subject:

What do you consider out of proportion? Gaza is a concentration camp, nothing else. It is completely controlled by Israel; there is no port, no airport, the border with Egypt is closed. How do you suggest people (that's actual human beings) get anything into the place?
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Dave Coull · Independentista Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 2809

Dave Coull · Independentista Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 2809

Dave Coull · Independentista Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 2809

Scotland86 · Gaining a Reputation Joined: 12 Dec 2008 Posts: 249

Dave i aint talking about what the founding father said im on about the here and now.

Hole as a few people have said countless times Gaza is one big civilian area which is why Hamas cant help but to fire rockets from within civilian areas. So where do you suggest this airport and port be situated? if theres no space in the civilian areas for to fire rockets from how the hell do you suggest they fit in an airport and port?

Dave Coull · Independentista Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 2809

Holebender · Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 3:35 pm Post subject:

A port, at least, can be build by dropping a load of boulders in the sea to form a harbour. people have done it for centuries. An airport would be trickier but, if the siege was lifted and people were free to move, perhaps enough people would be able to move to make some room. Or perhaps Israel could give back some of the land it occupies illegally, and it could be used to build an airport.

Where there's a will there's a way.

And while we're about it, please use my full name and stop the childishness.
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"My instinct is to agree with your opinion of his verse, but I've never so much as glanced at it." - agentmancuso

Scotland86 · Gaining a Reputation Joined: 12 Dec 2008 Posts: 249

There was no childishness meant in using "hole" but theres another assumption that you know me.

Dave for every person you bring up there is another saying the exact opposite. As with most world situations there is one section saying one thing and another section saying another.

Holebender if Israel was to listen to everything that is being said to them they would have no land left.

Holebender · Posted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 4:43 pm Post subject:

No, they would have the land they had in 1967. Why should they have anything more that their internationally recognised territory? Why should Palestinians be deprived of more and more of the little they have so Israel can have liebensraum?

Do you think the strong have the right to take what they want from the weak? Would it be right if the UK invaded the Faroes and took them over to make more space for people from overcrowded London?
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"My instinct is to agree with your opinion of his verse, but I've never so much as glanced at it." - agentmancuso

Dave Coull · Independentista Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 2809

Scotland86 · Gaining a Reputation Joined: 12 Dec 2008 Posts: 249

No Dave because if we talk about the Israelis you mentioned that too would be talking about SOME of them.

Holebender, its nothing to do with whos the "strong" and whos the "weak" when it comes to who i support. I support the Israelis on this because being surrounded on all sides by countries that have stated they will wipe Israel from the face of the earth they cant allow a softly softly approach. If they did allow Hamas an inch then the rest would take a mile and that may put them in more danger.