Archive for Our Scotland - www.our-scotland.org Scottish Politics Discussion Forum / Messageboard - Dedicated to online discussion about Scottish Politics and an Independent Scotland, as well as Scottish Society today. We also have a section dedicated to Banter, Sport and Recommended Sites.
|
Stevie
|
SCOTS CULTURALLY WALLOW IN MISERY. | Quote: | .....a Motion in Parliement?
Starkey in 'Scotland adores failure' rant
Published Date: 19 October 2008
By Fiona grey
The "subtlest rudest man in Britain" yesterday turned his acid tongue on Scotland in a three-pronged attack on its history, its politics and its people.
TV historian David Starkey called Mary, Queen of Scots, "a whore and a trollop and a murderess", accused the Scots of "adoring failure", and branded the SNP "utterly contemptible".
Starkey, who rose to fame presenting historical television programmes about the lives of the Tudors, was on a radio programme, giving his thoughts on the SNP's idea of returning Mary, Queen of Scots', remains to Scotland.
He said: "It's exactly the kind of Scottish sentiment that makes the Scottish Nats' shortbread, tartaned, biscuit-tinned view of Scotland that is totally and utterly contemptible."
Starkey, who has gained a reputation for acerbic outbursts against the Queen, the BBC and Tony Blair, made the comments on Radio 2 comedy programme, Clive Anderson's Chat Room.
He added that Mary, who he said despised being queen of Scotland, would hate the idea of being returned, and that actually made her the perfect heroine for a people who "adore failure".
He said: "The only victory (Scots] have ever celebrated is Bannockburn; the rest is about wallowing in failure. They even have special music for failure – it's called bagpipes."
The 30-minute panel show is billed as a fast-paced entertaining satirical talk show, during which opinionated panellists speak their mind about the hot topics of the day.
Although fellow panelist and journalist Eve Pollard rose to the defence of Mary, Queen of Scots, calling her the glamorous "other woman" compared with her cousin Elizabeth I, Liberal Democrat MP and Scot Charles Kennedy did not reply to Starkey's comments.
Starkey added: "The union (of England and Scotland] has always been based on mutual humour and mockery."
Starkey previously attacked Scotland in 2004, when he branded it an unimportant country until it was joined with England in the 17th century.
Following his comments a motion was tabled in the Scottish Parliament condemning the historian. |
I know this is not new but with the exception of Agent Mancuso and Aventinian, there does seem to be little by the way of a sense of humour penetrating the debates(I'm guilty too because I feel you are all sincere to the point of lacking a smile that's needed in the forum environment and I don't want to rock the boat). Do you agree? Let me add, I agree with you on the issues and with that a sense of humour would add more life to debates where people agree.
Dear Azzuri, please take this only as a desire to enliven the forum(probably, no doubt misguided but hopefully humour would attract more people of a wider persuasion).
This is NOT a criticism, more a question.
And it's an opinion and we all know "opinions are like assholes..."
|
Shagpile
|
Well....
IMHO We Scots hae a guid laugh at ourselves. A (realistic selfawareness?). I don't know but we do certainly have humour!
Is that contempt from Starky or a brag? I'd personally love to hi-jack his video prompter and post the margin of the yes vote..... and insert "NOW THAT'S f***ing FUNNY"!
The extent of our determination, is yet to be determined. Westminster feighnt? For sure.... they wont be laughing at the outcome!
No I'm not angry..... just confident.
Should this not be in the Scottish Polotics section?
|
Cruachan
|
Well, I am very far from miserable. 
I'm just back from a great week in Argyll with my family. Fantastic weather, friendly people with a welcoming smile and a story to tell, the beauty of the hills and the sea lochs. Great banter in the pubs. No it wasn't Cumbernauld on a wet Monday in January, and an overnight drive down south may be making me light headed, but Spring - and a Yes vote in the Referendum ? - is in the air 
|
Dave Coull
|
Re: SCOTS CULTURALLY WALLOW IN MISERY. | Quote: | | The "subtlest rudest man in Britain" yesterday turned his acid tongue on Scotland in a three-pronged attack on its history, its politics and its people. |
How can you attack a country's "history"? History isn't a person, it isn't even a collection of persons. You can DISAGREE about history, but I don't see how you can "attack" it. As for attacking a country's "politics", unless that refers to the politics of the GOVERNMENT, every country includes within its population people with different politics. So, of the three things David Starkey is supposed to have "attacked", only one of them CAN be attacked - "the people" of Scotland. And the evidence on whether or not he did that is inconclusive. | Quote: | | TV historian David Starkey called Mary, Queen of Scots, "a whore and a trollop and a murderess" |
"Whore" and "trollop" are emotive words, a bit harsh but not without some supportive evidence from history; and I think there is a prima facie case for saying she was at the very least an accessory to murder. But, in any case, regardless of whether the description is true or not, I don't see why harsh words about one particular person in French, Scottish, and English history should be regarded as an attack on "the Scots". | Quote: | | Starkey, who rose to fame presenting historical television programmes about the lives of the Tudors, was on a radio programme, giving his thoughts on the SNP's idea of returning Mary, Queen of Scots', remains to Scotland. |
Are they planning to do that????!!!!!! I think that's the stupidest idea the SNP has ever come up with! She loved France more than Scotland, and she did claim to be the rightful Queen of England, and it was her own son, James the Sixth, who had her remains transferred from their original burial place to where they are now, so why move them again? Are we going to transfer the remains of James the Sixth as well? And what about the remains of King Charles the First, who was born in Dunfermline, are we going to transfer his remains back to Fife? Where will this madness end? (Mind you, come to think of it, we could send "Saint" Margaret back to England......) | Quote: | | He said: "It's exactly the kind of Scottish sentiment that makes the Scottish Nats' shortbread, tartaned, biscuit-tinned view of Scotland that is totally and utterly contemptible." |
Well I don't agree with his view of the SNP in general, but I do think in this particular case he's got a point. | Quote: | | Starkey, who has gained a reputation for acerbic outbursts against the Queen, the BBC and Tony Blair |
He does make forceful comments. This helps his career as a TV historian. But the Queen, the BBC, and Tony Blair are all deserving targets. In this particular case, it would appear, so is the SNP. | Quote: | | He added that Mary, who he said despised being queen of Scotland |
True. | Quote: | | would hate the idea of being returned |
almost certainly true. | Quote: | | He said: "The only victory (Scots] have ever celebrated is Bannockburn; the rest is about wallowing in failure. They even have special music for failure – it's called bagpipes." |
In some ways Starkey is the historian equivelant of Jermey Clarkson, somebody who has made a successful career out of being a pompous self-important prat. | Quote: | | The 30-minute panel show is billed as a fast-paced entertaining satirical talk show, during which opinionated panellists speak their mind about the hot topics of the day. Although fellow panelist and journalist Eve Pollard rose to the defence of Mary, Queen of Scots, calling her the glamorous "other woman" compared with her cousin Elizabeth I, Liberal Democrat MP and Scot Charles Kennedy did not reply to Starkey's comments. |
How very wise of Charles Kennedy. | Quote: | | Starkey added: "The union (of England and Scotland] has always been based on mutual humour and mockery." |
What a very English viewpoint. | Quote: | | Starkey previously attacked Scotland in 2004, when he branded it an unimportant country until it was joined with England in the 17th century. |
In what way is that an "attack"? It may be true, or untrue, or a bit of both, but in what way is it an "attack"? | Quote: | | Following his comments a motion was tabled in the Scottish Parliament condemning the historian. |
Good grief. Starkey must have been delighted. Another boost to his career! What idiot did that?
|
Holebender
|
I will only bother to comment on one thing; Mary was Queen of Scots not Queen of Scotland. Her mother was Queen of Scotland, as were all queens consort, but Mary was a queen regnant and so used the proper title of Queen of Scots.
|
Shagpile
|
| Holebender wrote: | | I will only bother to comment on one thing; Mary was Queen of Scots not Queen of Scotland. Her mother was Queen of Scotland, as were all queens consort, but Mary was a queen regnant and so used the proper title of Queen of Scots. |
Ah so.... Do you think Mr Starkey knew that? Clearly he must have.... respected British Historian an'all. Hmm.... Guid ane.
|
Dave Coull
|
| Shagpile wrote: | | Do you think Mr Starkey knew that? |
I think it's quite likely he did. Although whether somebody from the media reporting what he was supposed to have said knew it is another matter.
|
Shagpile
|
The edit? No doubt his objections would have ben noted 
The interpritation is in the eye of the historian. He's more obsessed with her being a whore though. Still if that's what he believes fine, who am I to argue.
|
Stevie
|
I miss blackadder, even if I never posted on a thread with him his posts live on, his posts were funny.
COME BACK blackadder.
|
agentmancuso
|
If it's inane drivel you're looking for, you'll find Blackadder here.
|
Stevie
|
It would be nice if a sense of humour percolated through the threads.
I haven't read many of his threads, so I'll take your word for the inane.
|
mairead
|
Who pays any attention to the rantings of Starkey anyway. He's a Joke.
Anyway why would Mary, Queen of Scots be a whore. Whores sell their bodies, and I don't think Mary found it necessary to sell hers to make ends meet.
|
linoleum
|
hmmmmmmmmmmmm.no humour in this place.i disagree i've been pissing myself laughing at most of the stuff posted on here.comedy gold.
|
|
|
|