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Scott2006 · Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2009 8:59 pm Post subject:

OK Dave, I over-reacted as I was kicking myself for missing the 0. I withdraw the comment.

But, if we take 6 (really 5) million as a population i.e. Scotland, then that would be the sum we would have to contemplate - the Iceland scale of debt scenario.

So we can maybe determine the limits to what Brown can get away with doing though it appears to be merely re-arranging the deck chairs on the titanic. £25,000 per head of debt increase is doable but £250,000 is only sustainable with an economy and reserve currency like the USA.
We wont know until we are well into negotiating to get out of the UK what % of national debt we would have to take on.

_________________
Scotland deserves a First rate Parliament for a First rate People
The Scottish Parliamentarians who voted for Treaty of Union in 1706 and signed away Independence had been voted for by less than 2% of the Scottish population

azzuri · 'Our Scotland' Fossil Joined: 12 Sep 2005 Posts: 4291

Scott2006 · Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2009 10:44 pm Post subject:

The banks, loans, assets, are of a certain value including unknown other losses and right-downs.
If Brown/Darling overdo QE Quantitative Easing - helping us to lose a slice of the buying power of our currency in exchange for buying up immoveable, underperforming, physical assets - it can really only go so far before the currency markets get into the swing of things and anticipate the Bank of England's position, perhaps accelerating the rise in the balance of payments debts.

The out-going deputy at the Bank of England seems to believe the possibility of a stagnating economy similar to the Japanese experience after their property boom/bust, which lasted for over a decade, if memory serves. The Japanese kept deflationary inducing policies in place to guard against inflation which they believed would be worse if it got running through the economy.

http://www.parliament.uk/commons/lib/research/rp2009/rp09-010.pdf

Dave Coull · Independentista Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 2809

azzuri · 'Our Scotland' Fossil Joined: 12 Sep 2005 Posts: 4291

....I believe that's why smilies were created.
_________________
"Gordon Brown mistook a glut of cheap money and a global bull market for his own administrative genius. In so doing, he wrecked the economy. Had the Prime Minister been running a company, instead of a country, he would be facing an inquiry into allegations of criminal negligence." - Jeff Randal

"Every single person on this planet is unique. Just like everyone else..." - Random Guy in Edinburgh Pub

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until a majority of voters discover that they can vote themselves largess out of the public treasury." - Alexander Tytler

"There are four ways to spend money. A) You can spend your money on yourself, in which case you will strive for a mix of the best bargain and the best quality. B) You can spend your money on someone else, in which case you are still interested in a bargain, but the quality of the product or service becomes secondary. C) You can spend other people's money on yourself, in which case price is no object but quality becomes a great concern. D) Finally, you can spend other people's money on other people, in which case neither price nor quality is of great concern."

Possibly the funniest site in the world, 'The Daily Mash' - http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/

Dave Coull · Independentista Joined: 07 Nov 2006 Posts: 2809

Lord Pitsligo · Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2009 1:33 pm Post subject:

Reluctant Hero · Posted: Tue Feb 24, 2009 10:39 pm Post subject:

Public on the verge of supporting the banks to the tune of £1.3 trillion.

It really is quite sickening

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7906922.stm
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Visit the Our Scotland Blog at http://our-scotland.blogspot.com/

azzuri · 'Our Scotland' Fossil Joined: 12 Sep 2005 Posts: 4291

As much as I agree extra money being 'printed' creates inflation, that really is only so while the debt that is created (in the form of Gilts) DOES NOT have to be paid back. All debt is inherently DEFLATIONARY, as it is skimming from future production. As long as the 'Quantative Easing' doesn't actually become a reality (bar the 'toxic assets scheme), then the chance of hyperinflation seems to be zero as far as I'm concerned. If the UK government decides to default on it's debt and not pay bondholders, THEN is the time to panic and get your funds out of Sterling and into pretty much anything else (US dollars/Gold/property etc.). Until that point, we are heading for deflation and unless you know how to play the currency or precious metals markets, you should be holding plain, hard, cash.

All IMO of course...
_________________
"Gordon Brown mistook a glut of cheap money and a global bull market for his own administrative genius. In so doing, he wrecked the economy. Had the Prime Minister been running a company, instead of a country, he would be facing an inquiry into allegations of criminal negligence." - Jeff Randal

"Every single person on this planet is unique. Just like everyone else..." - Random Guy in Edinburgh Pub

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until a majority of voters discover that they can vote themselves largess out of the public treasury." - Alexander Tytler

"There are four ways to spend money. A) You can spend your money on yourself, in which case you will strive for a mix of the best bargain and the best quality. B) You can spend your money on someone else, in which case you are still interested in a bargain, but the quality of the product or service becomes secondary. C) You can spend other people's money on yourself, in which case price is no object but quality becomes a great concern. D) Finally, you can spend other people's money on other people, in which case neither price nor quality is of great concern."

Possibly the funniest site in the world, 'The Daily Mash' - http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/

Lord Pitsligo · Posted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 2:18 am Post subject:

azzuri · 'Our Scotland' Fossil Joined: 12 Sep 2005 Posts: 4291

....exactly. Gold's been a nice little earner for me since August 2006. I'm holding it as a hedge against further sterling devaluation now.
_________________
"Gordon Brown mistook a glut of cheap money and a global bull market for his own administrative genius. In so doing, he wrecked the economy. Had the Prime Minister been running a company, instead of a country, he would be facing an inquiry into allegations of criminal negligence." - Jeff Randal

"Every single person on this planet is unique. Just like everyone else..." - Random Guy in Edinburgh Pub

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until a majority of voters discover that they can vote themselves largess out of the public treasury." - Alexander Tytler

"There are four ways to spend money. A) You can spend your money on yourself, in which case you will strive for a mix of the best bargain and the best quality. B) You can spend your money on someone else, in which case you are still interested in a bargain, but the quality of the product or service becomes secondary. C) You can spend other people's money on yourself, in which case price is no object but quality becomes a great concern. D) Finally, you can spend other people's money on other people, in which case neither price nor quality is of great concern."

Possibly the funniest site in the world, 'The Daily Mash' - http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/

azzuri · 'Our Scotland' Fossil Joined: 12 Sep 2005 Posts: 4291

...anybody hear Jim Rogers on the channel 4 news tonight?

Grim news for the UK and UK bonds, but I think it's a good thing. The sooner people stop buying UK Gilts the sooner the country can itself stop being dependent on the production of other countries. Hopefully a systematic shock and emergency IMF funding will require us to dismantle the ridiculous bureaucratic state that Labour has created over the last decade.
_________________
"Gordon Brown mistook a glut of cheap money and a global bull market for his own administrative genius. In so doing, he wrecked the economy. Had the Prime Minister been running a company, instead of a country, he would be facing an inquiry into allegations of criminal negligence." - Jeff Randal

"Every single person on this planet is unique. Just like everyone else..." - Random Guy in Edinburgh Pub

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until a majority of voters discover that they can vote themselves largess out of the public treasury." - Alexander Tytler

"There are four ways to spend money. A) You can spend your money on yourself, in which case you will strive for a mix of the best bargain and the best quality. B) You can spend your money on someone else, in which case you are still interested in a bargain, but the quality of the product or service becomes secondary. C) You can spend other people's money on yourself, in which case price is no object but quality becomes a great concern. D) Finally, you can spend other people's money on other people, in which case neither price nor quality is of great concern."

Possibly the funniest site in the world, 'The Daily Mash' - http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/

Reluctant Hero · Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2009 10:32 pm Post subject:

Scott2006 · Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 7:41 am Post subject:

Well as we take a step into the unknown with a political and banking establishment that doesn't know its economic ar*e from its economic elbow - I came across this comment piece that even mentions the wheelbarrows. Do you think you can refer to "electronic wheelbarrows full" or "electronic wheelbarrows fool"?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment...tive-easing-bankofenglandgovernor
_________________
Scotland deserves a First rate Parliament for a First rate People
The Scottish Parliamentarians who voted for Treaty of Union in 1706 and signed away Independence had been voted for by less than 2% of the Scottish population

azzuri · 'Our Scotland' Fossil Joined: 12 Sep 2005 Posts: 4291

At the moment I believe the bank of England would need to print roughly £30 trillion in order to start REAL inflation, but they simply can't do that. This £150 billion or whatever it is is pissing into the wind and won't work. All this media scaremongering is going to encourage prudent savers to go out and spend their cash, which they shouldn't do as they'll need it when they realise they have no pension pots left and the government is forced to start dismantling the welfare state. It's time to pay the piper, the free party is now over.
_________________
"Gordon Brown mistook a glut of cheap money and a global bull market for his own administrative genius. In so doing, he wrecked the economy. Had the Prime Minister been running a company, instead of a country, he would be facing an inquiry into allegations of criminal negligence." - Jeff Randal

"Every single person on this planet is unique. Just like everyone else..." - Random Guy in Edinburgh Pub

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until a majority of voters discover that they can vote themselves largess out of the public treasury." - Alexander Tytler

"There are four ways to spend money. A) You can spend your money on yourself, in which case you will strive for a mix of the best bargain and the best quality. B) You can spend your money on someone else, in which case you are still interested in a bargain, but the quality of the product or service becomes secondary. C) You can spend other people's money on yourself, in which case price is no object but quality becomes a great concern. D) Finally, you can spend other people's money on other people, in which case neither price nor quality is of great concern."

Possibly the funniest site in the world, 'The Daily Mash' - http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/

Reluctant Hero · Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 11:03 pm Post subject:

The government has just increased its stake in Lloyds to 60%.

Who will be next?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7927415.stm
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Visit the Our Scotland Blog at http://our-scotland.blogspot.com/

azzuri · 'Our Scotland' Fossil Joined: 12 Sep 2005 Posts: 4291

saw this today and it sums up my feelings on the 'credit crunch' perfectly;

Shagpile · This is Ma' Life! Joined: 03 Jan 2006 Posts: 794

Shagpile · This is Ma' Life! Joined: 03 Jan 2006 Posts: 794

And of course there's this...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/financ...-fall-by-further-55-per-cent.html

azzuri · 'Our Scotland' Fossil Joined: 12 Sep 2005 Posts: 4291