Our Scotland - www.our-scotland.org Forum Index Our Scotland - www.our-scotland.org
Scottish Politics Discussion Forum / Messageboard - Dedicated to online discussion about Scottish Politics and an Independent Scotland, as well as Scottish Society today. We also have a section dedicated to Banter, Sport and Recommended Sites.
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   Join! (free) Join! (free)  
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 


The Big Lie...........
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Our Scotland - www.our-scotland.org Forum Index -> Scottish Politics and Independence
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
scottishjameseboy
Finding Ma' Way


Joined: 06 Oct 2006
Posts: 17
Location: Eastrenfrewshire Scotland

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2006 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Theresa thanks for the warm welcome great forum! It's great to be able to talk to so many fellow supporters of the cause, from all over not just Scotland. I have been in love with my country all my life, and it's very impotant to me. I love to show my devotion, and fly the saltire from a dummy car ariel, that was attached for that reason to my car's back window! I even had it painted on the roof of one car "dukes of hazzard" style. I read up on Scottish history all the time and play my "rebel" or "nationalists" songs when ever I get the chance.


"How am I a traitor when England is foreign to me" (The Wallace J Mclean)

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SLG
Born Again..........and still Scottish!


Joined: 16 Sep 2005
Posts: 5515
Location: Dłn Eideann

PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2006 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Welcome to the forum scottishjameseboy, glad you like it here. I think part of the deal with the forum if for folk to realise that there is widespread support for independence, despite the lack of attention from the media etc.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
scottishjameseboy
Finding Ma' Way


Joined: 06 Oct 2006
Posts: 17
Location: Eastrenfrewshire Scotland

PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2006 11:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think you are spot on SLG. I feel the "Scottish media" fails the folk of Scotland and to represent the true feelings of the Scottish folk' and the fact that many other country's fail to understand why we allow a parliament so far a way from us to tell us what to do. Take for instance poll tax we had it two years and they ignored our complaints, yet England had it a year and it was scrapped because of their complaint's. Proving we are nothing but a test bed for English crap. The folk of many nations some of which are smaller than Scotland support our cause as you say (as proven on here). What we need to do is bring all aspects of the argument for independence to the forefront of Scottish folk, not just the wee bits which are repeated all the time. I have sent my subscription a way for the Scots independent news paper and feel it's a shame it is not available in shops so more folk would know about out it, and understand the argument for self government and independence better.

whewww feel better for getting all that of my chest!! sorry for going on abit!!
_________________
"How am I a traitor when England is foriegn to me" (The Wallace J Mclean)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mairead
Jim Baxter is God...........really!!!!


Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 3091
Location: Argyll, Alba

PostPosted: Sun Oct 22, 2006 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For another BIG LIE check out the McCrone report of the early 1970's, which is now available under the freedom of information act. Its an eye-opener.
Before the next elections in 2007, every adult in Scotland should read how, why and by whom, Scotland was deprived of independence by Westminster. Write or email your MP for a copy of this report.
_________________
I fear not hell, nor English strife,
For Scotland, I will give my life
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Shyirasky
Finding Ma' Way


Joined: 18 Oct 2006
Posts: 8
Location: Moray

PostPosted: Mon Oct 23, 2006 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Scottishjameseboy

I thought we had the Poll Tax just a year before it was introduced in England, and wasn't it to get rid of our high rates or something akin to that?

I'm right in the middle of a Scottish politics course and my lecturer is from Yorkshire. Needless to say I'm probably getting a slightly skewed version of our history.

Shy
_________________
Shyirasky
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger
Aventinian
'Our Scotland' Fossil


Joined: 10 Dec 2005
Posts: 4276
Location: Broadcasting From An Anonymous Location Within the United Kingdom.

PostPosted: Mon Oct 23, 2006 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shyirasky wrote:
Hi Scottishjameseboy

I thought we had the Poll Tax just a year before it was introduced in England, and wasn't it to get rid of our high rates or something akin to that?


Yes, the Scottish Office wanted it immediately, whereas the government departments responsible for the rest of the UK said that they couldn't deliver it on time and needed an extra year to put the various systems in place.

This was in the face of a lot of dissatisfaction over the taxation system that existed before. So it's perfectly understandable.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mairead
Jim Baxter is God...........really!!!!


Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 3091
Location: Argyll, Alba

PostPosted: Mon Oct 23, 2006 8:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And the poll tax breached the act of union.
_________________
I fear not hell, nor English strife,
For Scotland, I will give my life
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Highlander
I Love 'Our Scotland'


Joined: 09 Apr 2006
Posts: 298

PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2007 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
And the poll tax breached the act of union.


And yet the people that were elected representatives in Scotland's councils and Scottish MPs at Westminister wanted it as soon as possible. The U.K. governement was actually doing what our democractically elected representatives wanted...how dare they!!!
_________________
British to the end
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Babygael
Collecting my 'Our Scotland' Pension!


Joined: 08 Apr 2006
Posts: 2479
Location: Bajan land

PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 2:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The death of the real Highlanders....results you!

How dare you desecrate their memory by calling your self a Highlander??
You engerlish settler!
_________________
Ath-bheothachad

Here is where I come to water my roots.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Aventinian
'Our Scotland' Fossil


Joined: 10 Dec 2005
Posts: 4276
Location: Broadcasting From An Anonymous Location Within the United Kingdom.

PostPosted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 4:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To be frank, very few people in Britain have any sort of purity in that sense. We're all settlers.
_________________
The resident pantomime villain.
'Socialists cry "Power to the people", and raise the clenched fist as they say it. We all know what they really mean—power over people, power to the State.'
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Highlander
I Love 'Our Scotland'


Joined: 09 Apr 2006
Posts: 298

PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Babygael wrote:
The death of the real Highlanders....results you!

How dare you desecrate their memory by calling your self a Highlander??
You engerlish settler!


Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

What are you on about!? "Real" highlanders, what does that mean? And what does that have to do with poll tax?
Here's a little piece of information for you, more highlanders have fought for the British state than against. However, I don't believe you are Scottish at all, lowland or highland.

Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
_________________
British to the end
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SLG
Born Again..........and still Scottish!


Joined: 16 Sep 2005
Posts: 5515
Location: Dłn Eideann

PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Highlander wrote:
Here's a little piece of information for you, more highlanders have fought for the British state than against.

How many Highlanders have fought for the British state?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Highlander
I Love 'Our Scotland'


Joined: 09 Apr 2006
Posts: 298

PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Countless thousands. The royal navy and army over the centuries have had thousands of Scots from the highlands in the ranks. I didn't think that would needed to have been typed but yet nationalists always surprise me with how often they need things simply and slowly spelled out for them.
_________________
British to the end
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Economist
I really have nothing else to do!!!


Joined: 22 Apr 2006
Posts: 939
Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Highlander wrote:
Quote:
And the poll tax breached the act of union.


And yet the people that were elected representatives in Scotland's councils and Scottish MPs at Westminister wanted it as soon as possible. The U.K. governement was actually doing what our democractically elected representatives wanted...how dare they!!!


Actually that's another unionist myth. Well firstly, it is pretty clear that about 90% of Scotland's elected representatives were against it, as were the councils. What everybody was in agreement about was reform of the old rates system. To put it another way there were different methods to administer local taxation - the poll tax was just one way (and the most unpopular). One of my lecturers at Uni was part of the team who drew up a short list of different types of local taxation for the government at the time (1986/87). There were several proposals on the table including the Poll Tax, reform of the rates, a local income tax, a property tax and a capital-type tax similar to the council tax. It was a Poll tax type structure that was decided by members of the government before the fine print was decided for Scotland. The government agreed there was a more pressing need for reform in Scotland, which is why was implemented there first. And there's no doubt there was an element of experimentation behind it.

I think the point about it breaching the Act of Union was that it was implemented in one part of the UK before another.
_________________
Taurus excreta cerebrum vincit - Bullshit baffles brains
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
SLG
Born Again..........and still Scottish!


Joined: 16 Sep 2005
Posts: 5515
Location: Dłn Eideann

PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Highlander wrote:
Countless thousands. The royal navy and army over the centuries have had thousands of Scots from the highlands in the ranks. I didn't think that would needed to have been typed but yet nationalists always surprise me with how often they need things simply and slowly spelled out for them.

Ok so countless thousands have fought for. That's a nice figure.

Now can you tell me how many have fought against it?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Mctosh45
I Love 'Our Scotland'


Joined: 15 Oct 2006
Posts: 300

PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 1:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would imagine more lowlanders fought for the British state than against or just more Scots in general given two world wars.........so what Confused
_________________
It is in truth not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom -- for that alone, which no honest man gives up but with life itself

(\_/)
(О.о)
(> <)
^ ^


Declaration of Arbroath 1320.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Me Bungo Pony
On A Journey (500 Miles)


Joined: 02 Feb 2007
Posts: 29
Location: Misty Llanarc by the Tay

PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2007 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Highlander wrote:
Here's a little piece of information for you, more highlanders have fought for the British state than against.

Considering the Jacobite rebellions were the only opportunity to fight against the British State, and the British State has been at war with just about every other country in the world at one time or another, your little bon mot is hardly a shock. Was there any relevance to it Confused .
_________________
It's a Sair Fecht
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DanaBC
No Longer a Wean


Joined: 22 Jun 2007
Posts: 62
Location: Victoria, BC, Canada

PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2007 8:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I too am of Scottish decent. I have done a lot of reading on the subject and I still don't understand what Scotland has to lose by seeking their independence.
I've read through this thread (and many others on other boards) and I can't quite get a clear picture of the pros and cons. The one "con" seems to be fabricated.
Why is it so hard to visualise an independent Scotland taking its place on the world stage?

I know it's not the same, but in 1982, our Prime Minister went over to England and brought our constitution home... made us self-governing.

Quote:
Your Majesty, Your Royal Highness, Excellencies, Fellow Canadians,

Today, at long last, Canada is acquiring full and complete national sovereignty. The Constitution of Canada has come home. The most fundamental law of the land will now be capable of being amended in Canada, without any further recourse to the Parliament of the United Kingdom.


It still gives me goosebumps when I read those words.... and we're still here....
_________________
Saor Alba
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Tearlach MacPolk
Finding Ma' Way


Joined: 25 Apr 2007
Posts: 10
Location: Arizona, USA

PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 12:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To SottishJameseboy:

{I read up on Scottish history all the time and play my "rebel" or "nationalists" songs when ever I get the chance.}

What are the names and artist of those "rebel"or "nationalists" songs? I am not familiar with this line of music.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Aventinian
'Our Scotland' Fossil


Joined: 10 Dec 2005
Posts: 4276
Location: Broadcasting From An Anonymous Location Within the United Kingdom.

PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 2:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DanaBC wrote:
Why is it so hard to visualise an independent Scotland taking its place on the world stage?


"It's place" suggests there's some sort of entitlement to secession. As a Canadian, I'd have thought you'd have some idea of the various matters relating to that from experience with Quebec, which is of course far more culturally distinct than Scotland is from the rest of Britain.

Quote:
I know it's not the same, but in 1982, our Prime Minister went over to England and brought our constitution home... made us self-governing.


Meanwhile we have always been 'self-'governing insofar as the phrase means anything at all.
_________________
The resident pantomime villain.
'Socialists cry "Power to the people", and raise the clenched fist as they say it. We all know what they really mean—power over people, power to the State.'
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Our Scotland - www.our-scotland.org Forum Index -> Scottish Politics and Independence All times are GMT
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Page 3 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

Card File  Gallery  Forum Archive
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
Create your own free forum | Buy a domain to use with your forum
Our Scotland Hit Counter 'Top Scottish Websites' - www.our-scotland.org Scottish Top Site - Topsites Top 100 Scottish Websites Our Scotland Forums Critical Acclaim ~ Politically Progressive Top Sites Tartan Army Topsites View Site Stats Our Scotland Blog Scottish Politics Scottish Lads