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| Upon Scotland gaining it's Independence from the UK, do you believe that England, Wales and Northern Ireland should remain together in union or would their interests be best served by splitting and becoming sovereign states? |
| England, Wales & Northern Ireland should stay together in Union |
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3% |
[ 1 ] |
| England, Wales & Northern Ireland should split as their interests are best served by becoming Sovereign Nation States |
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75% |
[ 22 ] |
| Don't Know / Have No Opinion |
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20% |
[ 6 ] |
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| Total Votes : 29 |
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Hazel
Nationalist
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Posts: 153
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 Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 11:48 pm Post subject: Independence |
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Isn't Isle of Man totally self-governing now. Isn't it independent but as a protectorate? I confess to not quite understand the distinction there but my understanding is that the British/UK government has nothing to say about what Isle of Man does except in some dire emergency where the Isle can no longer govern itself.
Getting off-topic there. Back to Scotland. Just wondering.
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Hazel
Chan ann air chall a tha gach neach air allaban. |
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Cymro
I need ma own bl**dy forum!
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 1423
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| Posted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:42 am Post subject: |
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The Isle of Man is a British Dependency. From listening to the British news etc you'd swear that the Isle of Man was like Anglesey, Skye, the Isle of White - just an island. But its never been part of the United Kingdom of Great Britian and Northern Ireland. It has its own parliament which is I think slightly more autonomous than the Scottish Parliament. I think I'm right in saying that it's home to the oldest pariament in the world.
They 'depend' on the UK for security, currency etc. |
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Hazel
Nationalist
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Posts: 153
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| Posted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 11:38 am Post subject: Isle of Man |
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"its never been part of the United Kingdom of Great Britian and Northern Ireland."
Hmmmm? Now that you write it and my brain starts thinking back, that looks quite true. I suppose I just assumed that it eventually got taken over like everywhere else. I've not delved into the history of Man as I should.
"They 'depend' on the UK for security, currency etc." Would that be international security, not local? And, does the Queen appoint a governor-general there as she does in Canada, Australia, etc.?
Thank you for explanation. Hazel
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Hazel
Chan ann air chall a tha gach neach air allaban. |
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Peter Dow
On A Journey (500 Miles)
Joined: 23 Feb 2006
Posts: 26
Location: Aberdeen
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| Posted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 2:49 pm Post subject: Re: Britain |
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| Hazel wrote: | Peter said, "Also, Scotland should have independent membership of the United Nations General Assembly but so should Britain - both Scottish and British nations exist and so both should be represented on the UN General Assembly. If England and the rest want on the UN General Assembly too, fair enough. That’s a policy idea.
Scotland
Britain
England (and the rest)
United Kingdom
I suppose I am being dense as usual but, among these four entities, where/what is "Britain"? Is this "Great Britain"? If so, according to my atlas, Britain includes England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and, I think, a few islands in the channel.
Always ready for clarification. Thanks. Hazel |
What is Britain, Hazel? Well politically speaking - THIS is Britain (click to my webpage Winston Churchill, 8th May 1945)
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Peter Dow, Scottish National Standard Bearer |
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Hazel
Nationalist
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Posts: 153
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| Posted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 3:39 pm Post subject: 8 May 1945 |
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Thank you. It has been a long, long time since we listened to that via old radio.
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Hazel
Chan ann air chall a tha gach neach air allaban. |
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SLG
Born Again..........and still Scottish!
Joined: 16 Sep 2005
Posts: 5515
Location: Dùn Eideann
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| Posted: Sat Mar 11, 2006 9:46 pm Post subject: |
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On a similar note, the BBC is running a poll on whether there should be an English parliament. This follows comments from the Lord Chancellor Lord Falconer saying that there definitely should not be an English Parliament.
http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk....stm?dynamic_vote=ON#vote_4792120
On an intervew on Radio 4 on the topic, Lord Falconer admits that devolution to Scotland and Wales had created an anomoly, but says "we must deal with that anomoly in a way that most promotes the Union". Not in the way that best deals with the anomoly, but the way that best protects the Union. |
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macnumpty
Getting on a bit!
Joined: 11 Feb 2006
Posts: 1856
Location: Exiled down south.
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| Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 10:44 am Post subject: |
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| Yes, but for "Union", read "Labour's majority in the Commons". |
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SLG
Born Again..........and still Scottish!
Joined: 16 Sep 2005
Posts: 5515
Location: Dùn Eideann
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| Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 11:51 am Post subject: |
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| macnumpty wrote: | | Yes, but for "Union", read "Labour's majority in the Commons". |
I don't know abuot that. For a lot of Scottish Labour, yes. I think Falconer is a Unionist of the traditional variety. Even if it meant Tory rule in Scotland again, he would still support the Union. |
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macnumpty
Getting on a bit!
Joined: 11 Feb 2006
Posts: 1856
Location: Exiled down south.
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| Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 3:11 pm Post subject: |
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I was feeling cynical this morning! I'm sure Falconer is a genuine Unionist, and to be honest the real cynicism should be directed at the "English votes for English laws" attitude of the Tories, who never saw passing Scotland or Wales-only legislation according to a Manifesto which had been rejected four times by the Scottish and Welsh electorates!
However, the key part of the current problem is what to do with England: the status quo is perceived as unfair, Assemblies based on artificially drawn up regions won't cut it (as we saw in the North East Referendum in 2004), an English Parliament doesn't seem to have enough support from mainstream politicians (add to that the perception of adding another tier of government, or what we would do with the UK MPs), and just tagging on a law that only English MPs can vote on English matters creates a potential fiasco in the event that the largest UK party isn't the largest party in England.
Frankly, "Independence all round" seems to be the best approach, but while I support independence, I don't like the idea of it being a default choice. |
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SLG
Born Again..........and still Scottish!
Joined: 16 Sep 2005
Posts: 5515
Location: Dùn Eideann
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| Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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| macnumpty wrote: | | Frankly, "Independence all round" seems to be the best approach, but while I support independence, I don't like the idea of it being a default choice. |
I understand that the manner in which it is achieved can influence how we then move on after the event. I don't think we will ever be in the position where Independence is forced upon us. Any move by the English will attempted within the UK. It looks to me like The majority of the 'Campaign for an English Parliament' etc don't really consider an Independent England. They just want an English Parliament because we've got one. If there starts to be a real demand for an English Parliament then they will get one, but that will not end the UK as such. It will then be up to us to go that final step. |
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azzuri
'Our Scotland' Fossil
Joined: 12 Sep 2005
Posts: 3792
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| Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 4:00 pm Post subject: |
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...........it is certainly a step closer however.
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SLG
Born Again..........and still Scottish!
Joined: 16 Sep 2005
Posts: 5515
Location: Dùn Eideann
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| Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2006 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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| rs_azzuri wrote: | | ...........it is certainly a step closer however. |
Aye, and it should push us in Scotland to move on a bit. My point was that I am pretty certain that England will never actively want to end the Union. A parliament, maybe, but sever the Union, no. It will be our decision and that should allow us to enter that era with confidence. |
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